Another DDNet map testing group

[Forris]

I will would like to found a map cheating group! Everyone can join!
*Irony off*

[teini94]

dont delete cuts! * ^^
and stop change releasing map (like all others) since 2 years 2 times per month

[Soreu]

[...] For me the most important thing in testing is, knowing how the gameplay should be. Then you can say which parts are bad, how he could improve something and stuff like that. [...]

Fun thing in this is that, you can understand gameplay just by being on server with mapper / playing it first with mapper & checking everything in meanwhile - and that's the main difference between groups going with mappers on servers, and DDNet testers just posting screenshots (mostly ofc)

[Ryozuki]

then we should only test if you are with mapper? .....

Please! We're getting really anoyed by people like you!

Tell me what i did? I jsut said an opinion

[Silex]

dont delete cuts! * ^^
and stop change releasing map (like all others) since 2 years 2 times per month

Oh pls not , stop fixing cuts. And more stop it when they released.

I think some mappers want to get their parts played. It's pretty shit for a mapper if the part who he worked hard for getting cuted easy.

And that's still my opinion.

@Ryozuki and Fňokurka oo7: I think you can continue your beef by pm.


First i think we should introduce the duty the mapper got to test/show 1 tester how the parts working. Some testers maybe join the server and they are motivated to test but just don't know how some parts work? And then they break up testing it.

Second i would like to see a other map testing group, separate for the design of the map. That would be really nice, because some maps getting released are still not that good designed imo. Maybe it's just changing the colour of unhookable, but even this makes a big difference! Also a suggestion add doodads, etc.

That are only 2 suggestions, maybe some of you do not think much about this, but i think it would be helpfull.

[Soreu]

[...]
Second i would like to see a other map testing group, separate for the design of the map. That would be really nice, because some maps getting released are still not that good designed imo. Maybe it's just changing the colour of unhookable, but even this makes a big difference! Also a suggestion add doodads, etc. [...]

Well, that's what iMTG also do - improving any aspect of map, including design. And there are also many guys willing to help with that if only someone ask them...

[imp]

The main problems about testing? I think there are quite a lot, it's really hard where to begin and where to end.

1. Testers should focus on a few maps only
I always had the feeling that testers tried to test every map on the forums. A tester should focus on a small amount of maps only so he could help the mappers in the best way. Testers would have more time to interact with the mappers too. That's actually pretty impossible when you are involved in 20 threads or so.

2. Fix minor bugs on your own
It doesn't help anyone to screen 20 graphical bugs. The tester should fix them on their own and should discuss the bugs on the testserver with the mappers. It's totally senseless to screen all bugs so the mappers fix them manually. It's so much wasted time.

3. It's still the mappers map!
You are a tester, nothing more. You are not the mother, the husband or the dictator of the mappers. By saying so: The map belongs to the mappers. I have seen a lot of threads where the (stubborn) testers almost commanded the mappers to change parts. It's still the mappers decision!

Mappers shouldn't change everything just because the testers say so. It feels like a father-son relationship: "Do what the father says". Mappers should get an own mind and shouldn't be frightened by the testers opinions.

4. Test the map with the mapper
This is so important. I think I don't need to add anything. It would make everything both for mappers and testers 100 times easier.

5. Testing doesn't mean playing the map only
I also have the feeling that a lot of testers are like "I race the map and it's tested". The majority of the mappers tested their maps serveral times with their friends or dummies. Testing the parts of the map is only 1 part of testing.

Apart from testing gameplay there also is:
- graphics: look if there are bugs or bad looking stuff
- editor: look if there are unused layers, mapres or wrong layer settings (too big etc.) -> keep the map small in data, don't need 2MB maps
- entities: look if there are invisible tiles or bugs, whatsoever

6. Some testers seem to be unexperienced
Some testers are not really good players, meaning that they have a lack in experience. The others seem not to know the possibilities you have as a tester. You can use a lot of commands to make your life easier.

7. Testers seem to be so "linear"
It's often the same. When some map has specific features like shortcuts or multiple ways to do a part it's immediately a bug. Just discuss stuff with the mappers before you command them what to change.

8. You are not cool for being a tester
I also have the feeling that some people want to become testers to be in the "VIP community". Just because you have a purple name doesn't mean you are any better than anyone else. Testing is hard work and not a "lol my name is purple I am so important for ddnet :O" job

9. Don't change release dates
Before a map should get a release date it should be tested well. It's foolish to change/remove maps from planned release dates because of a lack of testing

10. Inactive
Many testers are very very inactive. There are 30 (trial) testers and look how many really test

11. Communication
Some testers barely speak a single word english

12. Too bad map
Before you start testing a map you should look at it first. Would the map fit ddnet? Is it too bad? If a map is really bad don't "waste" too much time on it. Just show the mappers what to do better next time. "Not the testers should map the map"

[Ryozuki]

@imp: It's easy to talk instead of do something too

P.S: here i see only 18 http://forum.ddnet.org/memberlist.php?mode=group&g=10

[mod=deen]Please don't quote such a huge post fully, removed it[/mod]

[Novo]

First i think we should introduce the duty the mapper got to test/show 1 tester how the parts working. Some testers maybe join the server and they are motivated to test but just don't know how some parts work? And then they break up testing it.

Hmm i think a "tester" should know how parts working and if he dont get it he also can test a other map .
Imo the problem is if u test maps with mapper and he show u everything u cant rly say how the gameplay is and ofc u wont will find annoying parts that should be improved and other things .
Its better to test maps with 2 testers (both dont know map ) for gameplay .

[Forris]

The problem is that testers are testing maps they are not familiar with. If someone is a tester and is the whole time in spectator mode or plays very rarely he cant rate the gameplay.