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Re: Moderators on ddnet.
Posted: Wed Aug 20, 2014 12:41 pm
by Index
Hey,
to be honest I'm completely against moderators. Of course it would be a nice in some cicumstances. But I totally agree with deen, it would create a hierarchy of power. Players who know moderators would feel protected and could behave badly without getting punished. Also some people could be disappointed that they are not a moderator and/or would hate person x because he got modearte status. A community where everyone is equal with the same possibilities and rights is much, much better.
If there is no other way and you still want to nominate moderators, then Saavik should be a moderator for sure.
Re: Moderators on ddnet.
Posted: Wed Aug 20, 2014 2:09 pm
by kamillentee
Index wrote:Hey,
to be honest I'm completely against moderators. Of course it would be a nice in some cicumstances. But I totally agree with deen, it would create a hierarchy of power. Players who know moderators would feel protected and could behave badly without getting punished. Also some people could be disappointed that they are not a moderator and/or would hate person x because he got modearte status. A community where everyone is equal with the same possibilities and rights is much, much better.
If there is no other way and you still want to nominate moderators, then Saavik should be a moderator for sure.
+1
Nothing to add.
I cant remember an incident where mods were really needed. Deen is often at ddnetservers but ive never seen him at kicking somebody. For the simple reason its not needed. Because spec-kicking Suffices.
Have you ever played on +ddrace server with helper or something similar. If so you know what i mean
Please deen never give more rights to people.
Re: Moderators on ddnet.
Posted: Wed Aug 20, 2014 2:16 pm
by deen
Broken wrote:Having moderated the USA servers for almost 3 years, I can say that I think a moderator who really tries to be fair will most likely end up being hated by everyone. Both sides in any conflict want favoritism and are sure they are right.
However, there really are assholes out there, and there is no point in letting them be that. It seems I've never even seen the level of asshole-ness in european servers that I regularly saw in USA servers (lol). And the majority of my players tell me my biggest mistake was giving them too much slack. Even a couple of the assholes themselves later confessed to me they really thought I should have banned them.
I've seen my fair share of injustice. Being banned in front of Tsin and kBeeer as they casually chat (NOT afk) for the reason "Pedophile" by a known hater of mine, does not feel nice. Admins flaming you, does not feel nice. Everyone blindly pressing F3 to a funvote, does not feel nice. People forcing a map change on Micro when he is really far into fly out of hell, does not feel nice. Being constantly flamed or threatened, does not feel nice.
In ANY system of administration you get abuses, I think. Look at Teeworlds forums, you can't even make a simple damn joke without your post being marked up in red and getting a warning. The question is whether the positive tradeoffs outweigh the negatives. In this case, I think if you can find people serious about being fair, a good moderation team would create a more pleasant environment.
Just make sure people have a place to report admin abuse to an arbitrator perhaps, like a head admin.
Thanks for your opinion, Broken. I've seen it some times myself, that players just come at me and insult or annoy me to see when I will ban them. It's really annoying. Since you can't really ban someone for a longer time, mods and admins don't really have much power anyway. Banned players will just come back on another server and keep doing whatever got them banned, or they simply change their IP and do the same on the initial server. I still believe it's most useful to talk to players who block and insult instead of punishing them.
Re: Moderators on ddnet.
Posted: Wed Aug 20, 2014 2:25 pm
by kamillentee
To come back to the Main topic.
I dont really know how kicking works. Is the half server needed to get 50% if somebody want to kick a blocker or just 16 players.
Have spectaters the kick-vote-permissions. Could somebody in team 1-63 kick blockers in team 0.
I would change the vote system but not give mod permissions.
Re: Moderators on ddnet.
Posted: Wed Aug 20, 2014 6:46 pm
by deen
kamillentee wrote:To come back to the Main topic.
I dont really know how kicking works. Is the half server needed to get 50% if somebody want to kick a blocker or just 16 players.
Have spectaters the kick-vote-permissions. Could somebody in team 1-63 kick blockers in team 0.
I would change the vote system but not give mod permissions.
Generally you need > 50% YES of the total number of people who can vote in this case. For a map vote, that means every player on the server that is not afk. For a spec and kick vote that means every player in the same team as the player. When there are more than 24 players on the server, 12 YES votes are enough to kick or spec someone, but not for changing map. (that's only been in for a week I think).
Re: Moderators on ddnet.
Posted: Wed Aug 20, 2014 7:00 pm
by Ama
I guess its a bad idea most of players just call deen
i would say im a good moderator but then i would be the first kicking someone for something small becouse im the biggest rager ever
Re: Moderators on ddnet.
Posted: Wed Aug 20, 2014 9:10 pm
by imp
For sure people probably would be partisan. But one option - if you want to introduce moderators - would be to choose someone unofficially, so only deen knows who the moderator is. The moderator would reconnect to servers - if there are any problems - with another name, which is his official moderator name. I guess that sounds awkward and probably wouldn't work too long but it would be an option :p
The main problem could be that people start to fake moderators to make them look like fools or to simulate their power
Re: Moderators on ddnet.
Posted: Thu Aug 21, 2014 10:30 am
by deen
imp wrote:For sure people probably would be partisan. But one option - if you want to introduce moderators - would be to choose someone unofficially, so only deen knows who the moderator is. The moderator would reconnect to servers - if there are any problems - with another name, which is his official moderator name. I guess that sounds awkward and probably wouldn't work too long but it would be an option :p
The main problem could be that people start to fake moderators to make them look like fools or to simulate their power
This would be such a mess. I don't want people in power running around with fake names.
Re: Moderators on ddnet.
Posted: Fri Aug 22, 2014 12:03 pm
by Divine
But it's true that it's almost impossible to kick blockers. Maybe make it require less votes?
Re: Moderators on ddnet.
Posted: Fri Aug 22, 2014 12:57 pm
by deen
Divine wrote:But it's true that it's almost impossible to kick blockers. Maybe make it require less votes?
I did that before and then we had the situation that people were kicked who weren't even blocking. I think that happens even right now. I think it depends a lot on the people who are currently playing on the server. Some kick more easily, some a lot less.